Post "job offers" somewhere, for people willing to help (benevolent)
Closed, WontfixPublic


We could offer some "jobs" for those willing to help.

I can see some need for :

  • Community feeling gatherer and survey analyst
  • Website editor
  • IRC summarizer
  • Wiki master
  • Documentation editor


To be promoted on the website, and linked to some lab projects

philippej created this task.Nov 1 2014, 1:13 PM
philippej updated the task description. (Show Details)
philippej raised the priority of this task from to Needs Triage.
philippej added a project: Community.
philippej added subscribers: philippej, sebastian.
allan added a subscriber: allan.EditedNov 1 2014, 3:37 PM

I would like to be website editor. I can manage the effort to simplify and improve the communication, and also help new members to do the same.

Currently trying to get an overview of the wiki, found the need to delete and

@allan, please try to keep discussion in each task relevant for this task.

Fine for heat management deletion on the wiki, but next time please add a comment when deleting so we can understand the rationale.

allan added a comment.EditedNov 1 2014, 9:00 PM

The point i was trying to make is i need admin rights to delete anything. The comment is in the edit log, atleast thats the way to do it.
my {{delete|comment}} got eaten since the template didnt exist.

Dont know what a "wiki master" is, but i could do small things with admin rights directly instead of the above example.

Could the job description be added to firstpost to give a better idea of what each thing entails?

There is an obvious place in my landing page draft to include the link "apertus° is open to any contribution in a direction you want it to take. ", and then the specific list of offerings could be at

Rebelj12a added a subscriber: Rebelj12a.EditedNov 3 2014, 1:09 AM

The problem with these kinds of responsibilities and permissions as with any online group is trust and potential for major problems down the line.

Ive ran online communities before and while delegation of tasks and management permissions per se can be helpful in organization. It can also open the doors for administrative and power grabbing problems, or even childish behaviors such as wanting the position or requiring after a certain length of time to have people in higher positions. Otherwise you can create a schism in the community fairly easy and lose a lot of good people.

On the other hand continued elevation of position within ranks can cause there to be too many administrative personnel considering themselves (above) any task they consider menial and sending it off to others not within the same position. Therefore a lot of head staff very little working staff actually doing anything.

Again this can result, at the point of demotion from these ranks, in a schism, which causes discord amongst the community. It can create drama which is definitely not needed.

Its a gambit, a tricky one depending on what Apertus wants to do. All I can advise is approach with caution.

Ive known more than a few websites who have given powers, even to helpful individual members, ones who take on leadership roles and responsibility, only to have it hurt the community in general in the long run.

Power... does strange things to those unaccustomed to it. Especially with no in person, real life consequences for said individuals.

allan added a comment.EditedNov 3 2014, 2:38 AM

The power to overthrow is at no point given away. We all have to put trust in the operators of the apertus company, because if they arent trustworthy, any and all endeavours are flawed anyway.

So people are given the chance to prove themselves, to gain more responsibility as they show themselves to be worthy of the trust.
Its a foss project, volunteers aren't really in it for anything besides helping. There isnt a way to shine besides doing a job well, credit where credit is due. Given that almost everyone uses their real name, which can be traced back to them with reasonable accuracy, why would they tarnish that?

I see the point to be argued in the same sense as the possibility of someone finding anyone already on that list with malicious intentions, yes it could happen, but people aren't evil, chances are they want to discuss cameras if you ever meet someone in the real world that know you from here.

And if someone misbehaves you take away their power, same reason a position should be held by someone who actually has the will and ability to do it. If you lose that, the point isn't there anymore.

I believe in the type of structure where everyone is their ability to do something, you find out what the job is, and then someone who is able to does it. If everyone overlaps somewhat, you have no ideas that are misrepresented. You lose the ability of being able to use people as if they are expendable, but that isn't community structure to begin with, because a community for the sake of it cant be built around that.

Personal status, power, and all sorts of other things are false ideals.Scepticism fast approaches irrelevance. Focusing on things that matters is real. If the work needs doing, just do it.

All good in theory, but in practice especially online its much more difficult.

Even should someone have power to delete articles. In anger ive seen people with lower powers do all they can to sabotage efforts by a larger group. i.e. deleting every article they can, losing a lot of research and discussion on a topic.

I would entrust this to Apertus, however in my opinion at no point should anyone not in their employ and not contractually obligated hold a position of any kind with respect to administrative type duties. Including modification and deletion that cannot be reversed.

However even having someone specifically in charge over a certain project has its own complications. In the advent of a larger base community, drama can unfold in terms of said moderator attempting to either appeal to the general populace or sow discord in an effort to either get what they want or leave in shambles. The whole scorched earth thing seems to be really popular with angry people on the internet.

In addition, Apertus wouldn't want said administration personnel to deal consistently with requests for power and elevated duties. Not that Im saying your discussion isn't warranted, what i'm saying is that in a larger perspective for a larger community this becomes troublesome and distracts the administrator from being able to do their job and distracts the community from the important matters.

It is a conundrum overall, and any decision is not without its own pitfalls.

Very interesting guys!

This in fact lead me to 2 ideas :

  • posting fixed job offers doesn't acknowledge the diversity of people we have. For example a content editor might as well be a very good coder, or video editor or whatever. So why lock ourself into "job" positions like traditionally done? Our community is already much richer than that.
  • why reinvent the wheel and even post job offers when we already have a bug tracker with clearly "unassigned tasks" waiting for someone to work on it?

Let's use what we already have and simply ask people who want to contribute to look at open, unassigned tasks in lab. There is already so much to do after 2 weeks of use.

4nd1 added a subscriber: 4nd1.EditedNov 3 2014, 10:09 PM

hi, just some sort of crawled through the irc logs of the past days to look at and bookmark all ( or some of ) the URLs, like

allan added a comment.EditedNov 3 2014, 10:55 PM

I cooked up this little update that can be sent out to backers:

Progress is very good, there is actually more to be done than people doing it, to the point where everyone has a bit more than enough to do.
This is a nice chance to contribute towards apertus, and gain valuable insight in return.

As always apertus is open where you think you might fit in.
If you posess a skill you think might be needed, please offer your services. <to link>

The wiki, social media, statistics, IRC and website are all areas where anyone can make a difference.

Visit our lab <link> to see if anything tickles your interest.

4nd1 added a comment.Nov 4 2014, 3:38 PM

What about some structure in/for the wiki? In the moment we have about hundred pages ( 106 to be precise ), as the numer of pages increase, it will be harder to find any information.
I propose to move e.g. ElphelVision pages to a separate namespace ( or something alike , as I am not "the MediaWiki expert" )

philippej closed this task as Wontfix.Nov 4 2014, 3:53 PM
philippej claimed this task.

@allan, will keep your update text for when we'll announce lab to all bakers (currently only announced to team, in order to scale as nicely as possible). Also I still need to find a way to link to open, unassigned tasks in lab.

@4nd1, would you want to work on writing docs from irc logs ?

If any of you want to work on the wiki, please coordinate on T122: reorganize wiki

Closing this one since it's too generic. Yes, I just won't fixed my own proposal :-)

4nd1 added a comment.Nov 4 2014, 4:49 PM

having a problem with documenting the Discussion about sliders and rotary dials without bringing in my personal opinion, which I should not do as a documenter...
although extracting keywords would perhaps help not to go through the same discussions again and again.
extracting links would be a question of just setting up a simple script - if this could be of any use
[off topic] cannot imagine setting a camera value by using linear controls as e.g. sliders, although I appreciate faders when using a (sound)mixing console - compared to rotary knobs - on the other hand, it is very easy to distinguish about 16 different positions looking at a rotary knob ( or scale, imagine a wall clock or a compass ), whereas 10 positions are very hard to distinguish on a linear scale ( slider )
[very off topic]do we have something like user Interface from the Viewpoint of usability ( having intuitive handling in mind, and if so, which story should be behind it?)

You can post your own opinion while documenting, something like (author note : blabla), I see no problem with that.

Created T133 for you :-)